robertr

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ESC Recomendations Please.
« on: April 21, 2018, 06:27:33 am »
https://www.banggood.com/DYS-XS-30A-3-6s-Lipo-BLheli_S-ESC-Electronic-Speed-Controller-Support-OneShot42-p-1060355.html?cur_warehouse=CN
 Hello, I am looking for a reliable upgrade from my crappy 30a SimonK esc's, they keep burning out in minor crashes even after disarming.
 I am new to mini quads and am not sure what to look for, or what will work with the CC3D controller.
 I have the Racerstar 2205 2300kv motors 2 of which also burnt up when the esc's failed.
 What do you think about the ones in the link above, it says they will run Oneshot 125.
 I am open to suggestions if there is a better choice. Thanks, Robert.

sam028

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2018, 11:26:20 am »
I'm using these https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-RS20Ax4-20A-4-in-1-Blheli_S-Opto-ESC-2-4S-Support-Oneshot42-Multishot-for-FPV-Racer-p-1068210.html on Racerstar 2205, with a Revo controler board.
I don't see why it would not work on a CC3D board.

Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2018, 03:59:21 pm »
Hello, I am looking for a reliable upgrade from my crappy 30a SimonK esc's, they keep burning out in minor crashes even after disarming.

Do you have a link for the exact bad ones you bought?  If they are less than $4 shipped like on eBay, I may buy a set to test.  I always flash the latest SimonK before using them and haven't had problems yet.  I confess that I probably don't pull more than 20A though.

robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2018, 05:59:27 pm »
Thanks Sam028, did you use Oneshot 125 setting in LibrePilot? I noticed the esc you listed does not mention 125 and LibrePilot only goes up to Oneshot 125.
 


robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2018, 06:44:55 pm »
 TheOtherCliff, thanks for your response, here is a link to the esc' I bought.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4x-HP-SimonK-30A-ESC-Brushless-Speed-Controller-for-Multicopter-F450-F650-X525/32561345270.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.P0qHLV
 TheOtherCliff, do you know if the esc's I listed in my first post will work, they say they are Oneshot125 capable.
 Do I have to pick an esc that is 125 capable and should I rule out the Bheli S and 32 esc's.
 Also do I need some kind of a usb programmer to set up the esc's or can I use them right out of the box.
 Some pics of the burnt esc's and motor.



Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2018, 08:13:37 pm »
Sorry, I can't really help you with OneShot and I'm not suggesting you buy something else.  There are guys around here that can help you with setting up your OneShotX.

Some soapbox opinions (backed by good arguments) follow.  I know there are those out there that think this is wrong, but I think the math is on my side.  :)

(I like the idea of having bullet connectors soldered to the ESC board, but I've never bought any like that.)

I have never used OneShotX.  Many users have.  I use PWMSync / [email protected]  I did a little back of the napkin calculation a while back and it seemed to show that (given good control/stabilization algorithms) OneShotX gives only a tiny (probably not humanly noticeable) advantage and that anything faster (MultiShot, Dshot) didn't help (over OneShotX) a human pilot flying a realizable aircraft with standard RC equipment.

To actually use the fastest update times, you need battery/wiring/esc/motor/prop/arm that can handle unrealistically huge amounts of power and torque.  When you make it respond twice as fast, it takes twice the power to do it, and it causes twice the stress on the aircraft.  These protocols are 80 times faster, but if that were actually used it would consume 80 times the amps, fry the wiring/ESC/motor, and snap the prop and arm.  The truth is that for a human, from slowest protocol to fastest it means the difference between a response time of 0.275 and 0.276 seconds and way less than that for the difference between the slowest and fastest in the Dshot/MultiShot group.  These may eventually help a millisecond fast computer program in computer controlled racing, but not me.

If I were in the top 20 of quad racing worldwide, I would probably research it more.  As it is, I find that even a well built cheap quad can be set up and tuned to rotationally accelerate (the real test of fast control) very quickly and stop on a dime.  AutoTune works fairly well for this.  I just won't need more.  I think that some of this is driven by "innovate or die" to drive downloads and sales.  Certainly the ESCs you linked are not wastefully expensive.

robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2018, 08:39:03 pm »
 That was my thinking when I bought those SimonK esc's, thought they would be plenty good enough for me just starting out but the reliability of them is the problem. I have one option from Sam028 and the one I listed in first post, I will keep my eye out for more that might work.
 Thank again, Robert.

Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2018, 08:49:50 pm »
The issue here is that you should run a matching set of ESC/motor/prop.

Short of tossing them, if it were me, and I had 3 good ones I would either make a tricopter :) or buy one more.  In either case I would flash them all with the latest SimonK.

One reflex to develop is to chop the throttle when there is a problem, even before it hits sometimes.  Sometimes to keep it from flying away, sometimes to keep it from stalling out with grass wrapped around the prop.

robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2018, 09:05:15 pm »
 I have been stealing esc's from my 550 quad to keep the 5 inch in the air. Down to two left on the 550 so if I blow another one I am going to take the three good ones from the 5 inch quad and use them on the 550 quad. Then new esc's for the 5 inch.
 That is the plan right now anyway.
 Any info on here about flashing SimonK esc's? The search function is not working for me.

mr_w

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2018, 09:51:50 pm »
I'd just throw in some thoughts on this -
Your average diy quad costs at least $100 in components - motors, frame, flight controller, receiver, props. Then throw in fpv camera, video tx, maybe even HD cam and whatnot. To be honest, price can go only up. Not down. Then count in your time you invest. That time is not free.

When I sum all that up, it makes no sense to me to go "cheap" on ESC/s like these - They use older firmware, older hardware design, components of unknown quality, they are super bulky!! .. and 4$? What, compared to modern stuff like these:

https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-RS30A-30A-Blheli_S-OPTO-2-4S-ESC-Support-Oneshot42-Multishot-for-FPV-Racing-p-1063907.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN

They are tiny! (13x28mm!), reliable, support all the protocols, they do not heat up at all (! rds_on on mosfets they use is ridiculously low), and they come at what price? $9!

For me that is a no-brainer. (if you don't need 30A, there are 20A that are even cheaper, especially if bought in packs of 4 or whatnot).

Now just to be clear, I am not trying to say that any particular brand or model is better than another one, but just saying that everything that runs blheli_s has fairly standard design featuring top quality components.

On a side note, why do I actually love DShot - because it requires no calibration at all. Just set neutral and you are ready to roll. spin. take-off.


mr_w

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2018, 10:07:17 pm »
The issue here is that you should run a matching set of ESC/motor/prop.

Well, its a shame I don't have any photos to show (though I can repeat this experiment) -

I was recently flying one of my 250 quads like this - front props were DAL T5045 (3 blade)
one rear was RaceKraft 5051 (3 blade) and the other rear was 2 blade 6 inch bullnose.

Escs are 3 different brands/generations, DYS blheli_s, littlebee blheli_s and littlebee (regular), I am unsure of exact configuration, but they did run mix of protocols (DShot and OneShot125).

When I fly FPV, I can't really say it feels any different from any other quad I fly. I use 4S batteries, do quite aggressive style, lots of rolls, flips and so on.

What is my point here? My point is that it matching components like that doesn't make all that much difference. If any. Thats my personal opinion.


robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2018, 11:17:34 pm »
 Thanks for the input mr_w. The Racerstar esc's seem to be popular, I may try those.
 Thanks again.
 I was on LibrePilot earlier and in the motors tab under banks there are options for different esc's, they are, PWM, PWM Sync, Oneshot 125, Oneshot 42 and Multishot.
 So I imagine any of these esc's will work,  correct?
 Also can I choose any option if all are supported by the esc
 As an example the esc you listed supports  Oneshot42,Multishot, Dshot150 and Dshot300. Can I choose Oneshot 42 or Multishot or does LibrePilot choose automatically?

mr_w

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2018, 12:24:58 am »
Best would be to use LibrePilot "next" version, and then choose DShot for esc protocol.

As Cliff noted before, there is no noticeable performance difference between pwmsync, oneshot*, multishot and dshot modes. The only difference that DShot makes is that there is no calibration process. It is not even optional. Simply it does not exist. Works out-of-the-box.


robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2018, 02:07:17 am »
 I forgot about the Next version. I will download it and check it out.
 I will most likely order the esc's you linked because I prefer the single esc's to the all in ones.
 Thanks again for everone's help. I might need it again. Robert

robertr

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Re: ESC Recomendations Please.
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2018, 02:56:15 am »
 I remember the Next version now. I remember it does not work with my CC3D controller.
 Something about not enough memory or something so I went back to 16.09