[Ross0390]

Hi all,

I have just bought a second hand kylin 250 quadcopter with a built in cc3d. I cant get it to connect to GCS 16.09, so ive routed through the forums and found out how to enter rescue mode.  It shows here that it has firmware, RELEASE 13.06.04 and bootloader 3 installed.
Im guessing the connection issue is due to the firmware version being too old for GCS 16.09, which matches the wiki info for bootloader installation instructions, however, i cant find the GCS 12.10.2 download as suggested in the wiki, anywhere online....
Does anyone know where i can get this version of GCS from? or if its possible to upgrade the bootloader 3 to BL4 via GCS 16.09.
Or have i bought an expensive brick....

Many thanks in advance for any advice!

Cheers

Ross

[TheOtherCliff]

Well if it was flying well when it was mothballed, I would suggest that you initially use the old 13.06.04.  Test fly it with that.  Export the settings to a file and also make some screen captures of the GCS pages (Hardware, PIDs, Input, Output, and Flight Mode Switch at least).

Before test flying, check the modes that are set up on the FMS and make sure you start with the one that has self leveling (Attitude mode).

This all assumes that you got a working RC radio with it.  If not, I would still install the 13.06.04 on the computer to be able to view settings and export the settings file, but I then would uninstall that from the PC and install whatever version of LP you are going to use (generally 16.09 or next-rXXX)

Lipo flight batteries don't last that long unless carefully refrigerated, and even RC radio batteries are suspect at that age.

Understand that with the old version and the radio that came with it, you probably have it flying right now.  If you upgrade, you will be starting over as if you just built it.  There is some learning that you will need to do.

Then, as I recall, if you want to upgrade it to more recent versions, I believe that you can install the new bootloader using either the old OP 13.06.04 GCS (try it first) or the new LP GCS.

You didn't mention what OS you have, but you can Google for (capitalization not important):
(for windows):
  "OpenPilot-RELEASE-13.06.04-win32.exe"
(for Mac):
  "openpilot-release-13.06.04-osx.dmg"
I have seen it apparently for download on several foreign web sites.  Be careful !!!   I would download from several sites and compare the downloaded files (e.g. md5sum them).  If they are the same, it gives a small amount of safety against them having malware code in them.  Still do not install.  First upload to virustotal.com and if they say it is clean, then install it.  You probably want to do a backup of your computer (to external hard drive) first to be safe.  You should be doing that anyway. 

If you are a beginner, this post may be helpful:
https://forum.librepilot.org/index.php?topic=4408.0

[Ross0390]

Firstly, sorry for my slow reply, i've been waiting for the receiver to arrive so had to stop thinking about it for a few days... I was getting itchy thumbs!

Thanks so much for the advice, i really wish id read it before i started messing around...  i managed to connect in rescue mode, backup the original 13.06.04.bin file to my pc, then i tried unplugging the usb, clicked 'Upgrade & Erase' (not expecting it to work as id tried several times with usb connected...) plugged it back in, and its now flashed with the latest firmware... Great!  Well, sort of... I set up my transmitter, went through the wizard and picked one of the default stabilization setups for the closest spec'd drone i could find and flew 2 batteries today! 

It flies ok, but is a bit jittery, especially in turns, yaws left on hard throttle(70-80%) then to the right when i let off... 

Now im wandering? Is there a way to 'read' the backup 13.06.04.bin file without flashing to the fc and loading up the correct openpilot gcs?  Id love to just put those settings back in as i assume it was flying well. But i will start looking into tuning on librepilot anyway... I've messed around with PID's in betaflight on my tinyhawk after flashing esc's for 48khz rpm filtering, but that was fairly simple compared to this...

[TheOtherCliff]

I set up my transmitter, went through the wizard and picked one of the default stabilization setups for the closest spec'd drone i could find and flew 2 batteries today! 

It flies ok, but is a bit jittery, especially in turns, yaws left on hard throttle(70-80%) then to the right when i let off...

Two comments:
- Using a canned configuration, a lot of things really need to be the same as the original vehicle.  Different props, motor KV, battery, etc. can make it different enough that it doesn't match well.  File->Export UAV... (with USB plugged in) before making changes, to save your settings since it is at least flying.  Then maybe try default settings to see if you like it better?
- Yaws left / right with more / less power ... Are you running the same prop (except for CW vs. CCW) everywhere?  Are all your motors the same brand/model/KV?  Same brand/model of ESC? If yes, yes, and yes then I suggest that you calibrate your ESCs (it could help even if there is a no in there):
https://librepilot.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/LPDOC/pages/12058743/ESC+Calibration
This is generally caused by one or more motors putting out a different amount of power than the others.  You might see a difference in Min/Neutral/Max on the Output page or you have one ESC calibration that gives different power than the others (that ESC calibration / neutral setting procedure will fix these both).
Also, make sure that Stabilization->Advanced->PirouetteCompensation is disabled, but that should only be an issue for flight modes that don't "self level".

Now im wandering? Is there a way to 'read' the backup 13.06.04.bin file without flashing to the fc and loading up the correct openpilot gcs?

I believe you are saying that you read and saved the firmware.  Understand that there are two different storage areas, one for the program (firmware) and the other for the settings.  You have the program, but if you ever did anything that does "Erase Settings" (like Upgrade & ERASE) then the settings are gone.  Not such a big deal since it is configured well enough to fly and that is the biggest hurdle.  Get your yaw issue fixed and go from there.

[Ross0390]

Thanks again Cliff, I think a large part of the problem is just me being a perfectionist...

I've followed the link you sent and calibrated the motors several times. The value each motor begins spinning at changes, everytime i calibrate but I've managed to get the values to 'settle' finally between 1056-1060 by experimenting with how long I waited between plugging in the lipo/hearing the beep and then pressing home to zero the throttle. The count of 3 seemed to work best...

However it still yaws on its own a little bit, when hovering Los, it very occasionally drifts one way or the other on the yaw axis, its very slight, I even tried adjusting the endpoints and trim on my tx but it still does it. Once moving forward it seems OK until I punch the throttle up hard, once up to 70-80% it will yaw to the left proportionally with the increase of throttle. At 100% I'd say it was around 30degrees left of centre on the yaw axis. Then if I drop the throttle it yaws back the other way across the centre line to a similar angle but on the right.
It really is nothing compared to the yaw kick on the rc helicopter I used to fly so I can live with it, but it would be nice to get it feeling a bit more locked in so I can build my confidence up to some more aggressive acrobatic flying.

In answer to your question about the props, they're a matching set of align 6" 6040 bi blades, they're not brand new but there's no obvious damage or signs of impact so I figure they're balanced. It sounds silky smooth on a still day.
The motors are all matching, kylin 2204 2300kv's, one of them sounded rough in comparison to the other 3 at neutral value during setup. But spins consistently with the others.
The escs are 4in1, and specifically for this model only I believe.
Also, pirouette compensation is turned off.

[TheOtherCliff]

I can't think of a way that CC3D should go 30 degrees yaw and then come back, depending on throttle setting.  Actually, that sounds like you have yaw set to Attitude mode.  We usually recommend AxisLock or Rate for yaw.  Don't worry to change that till you get your 30 degree issue sorted...

The most likely thing I can think of is that you are using a FlySky I6 transmitter.  I had the exact same issue, add throttle and it yawed.  It is a loose wire in the transmitter issue.  Look here to see how to prove that you have this issue, and how to fix it.  Post back if this shot in the dark hit the mark. 
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?p=38300831&postcount=1755