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cato

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Cinetank MKII
« on: November 05, 2015, 11:51:33 am »
Payed loads of taxes and customs today, and got a few very thrilling packages :)

My next project: It's a Flying Cinema Cinetank MKII. First step will be to get it fly with CC3D or Revo (if my Revo clone works). There will be no Gimbal or FPV at that stage, which will be added later. Plan is to add some more features, like OSD and maybe some Frsky sensors. I like the voltage sensor very much and want to try the altitude/velocity sensor.

Controller will be my Revo Clone (provided it works), maybe later a Sparky2. Motors are Elite 2216, ESCs are Afro. Bought 4s batteries and later found out that the Elite are specified for 3s, bummer, but I may try 4s anyway ;)

I have a wish list for far future, which I have not thought through so far:
- get I2C mag working. Cliff did a lot work on that already, so I am sure this will work
- Get S-Port sensor data (Frsky Sensors) into the Revo and OSD. No idea if that is possible.
- OSD with HUD information like artificial horizon, throttle position, velocity and altitude and all that kinda stuff.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2015, 12:32:18 pm by cato »
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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ArnhemAnt

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2015, 01:56:25 pm »
Very excited for you.

I have a CineTank MK1 that I am currently building. Progress has been halted for a little while due to work/family and general life just getting in the way. Mine is a customised build with extended landing gear and custom plates to hang a 3-axis gimbal. Definitely going to be using either a Revo (which I already have) or maybe even a Sparky. My build is purely for aerial video and I just want a solid, dependable platform.

I'll be keeping an eye on the progress of your build man - sounds interesting. And, of course, if Cliff has done some work on testing, etc, then you are well on your way. He knows his stuff and is keen to help others as much as he can.
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If you do what you need, you’re surviving. If you do what you want, you’re living.
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2015, 08:06:49 pm »
That is interesting to hear, ArnhemAnt. I don't know the differences between MKI and MKII, but would like to see how your's looks, especially with the custom 3 axis gimbal. I have a 2 axis gimbal ready, but need a gimbal controller, still.

So far I like the frame very much, it is very light and well thought through. There is loads and loads of space for your stuff, so I attached an X8R receiver with FrSky Voltage sensor and Variometer via the X8R Smart Port.

The controller is the Revo Clone which I bought at Amazon, with M8N GPS and I2C magnetical compass.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 11:05:24 pm by cato »
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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ArnhemAnt

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2015, 10:32:08 pm »
I'm away from home at the moment, but will post up some pics of my build when I get back next weekend. From what I understand, the MK11 is a slightly lighter frame.
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If you do what you need, you’re surviving. If you do what you want, you’re living.
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2015, 10:45:58 pm »
I enjoyed a happy Saturday, finishing the basic setup. This afternoon my Cinetank took off first time in it's existence, and of course I did a little video of it. I had done a basic calibration with the revo outside the frame before, so it was not perfectly balanced, and I think the cloud default tuning for cinetank is a bit on the safe side, but otherwise everything worked out perfectly.

If someone wonders about the golde hubs: My motor set contained 3 CCW and 1 CW hub :( So I went to the local do-it-yourself shop and bought a few M6 hub nuts, which fortunately fit :)

Tomorrow first extended test, currently conditioning the new batteries :)

« Last Edit: November 08, 2015, 12:44:54 am by cato »
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2015, 10:35:41 pm »
Oh well,

first flight kinda successful. Had lots of obstacles, for example the Taranis catched moisture and did not work properly for a while, the revo clone does not work properly in EKF, and well, I had bought crapy rotors, which lead to a bad crash which broke one of the arms. So now waiting for a new revo, a set of spare arms and proper carbon propellers ... but still had lots of fun, mostly with my little one, and the Nighthawk will get proper carbon propellers now as well.

Next step will be to use the Mobius as FPV cam. The quad is not so speedy as a 250, so the Mobius should be ok for now.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2015, 07:06:58 pm by cato »
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2015, 07:09:49 pm »
My Cinetank is now almost ready to fly, but it's raining cats and dogs. So I thought I'd show you what Andreas from the German RC dealer pitchpump does with his Cinetank MK I:

https://player.vimeo.com/video/89319760

how do I embed vimeo here?
« Last Edit: November 20, 2015, 07:14:37 pm by cato »
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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ArnhemAnt

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2015, 10:55:21 pm »
Quote from: cato on November 20, 2015, 07:09:49 pm

how do I embed vimeo here?

Good question. I just tried and got the same result as you. Regardless, that dude can sure throw that frame around in the air. That sort of flying is usually done with a much smaller frame.

My building (CineTank MK1) has been halted due to work commitments. I hope to start again in a few more weeks.
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If you do what you need, you’re surviving. If you do what you want, you’re living.
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2015, 03:37:33 pm »
First stage of my Cinetank is finished now. It is now equiped with a Revo Clone from Ebay and a fixed holder for the Mobius cam. As propellers I decided for a relatively expensive brand, Auro-Naut Cam Light carbon-nylone mix. They have excellent flying characteristics, reduced noise and longer flights. First flight tests are positive, if weather allows I will do intensive testing tomorrow.

Cables now braided in the arms, and more cleanly setup. Only the ESCs need a bit cleaning up, still. The quad is not well balanced at the moment, as it is thought to carry a gimbal at the front end. This will need to wait a while, some parts for the gimbal are still missing, and I need to create a holder for the Moius Gimbal from Hobbyking, as I don't plan to buy GoPro stuff at the moment.

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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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mazevx

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2015, 06:59:16 pm »
As I read about your problems with the props I thought I recommend the aeronaut cam carbon light to you, but you already choose them ;-)
To my opinion its the best you can buy at the moment.
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2015, 11:52:07 pm »
Quote from: mazevx on November 21, 2015, 06:59:16 pm
As I read about your problems with the props I thought I recommend the aeronaut cam carbon light to you, but you already choose them ;-)
To my opinion its the best you can buy at the moment.

I did a short test flight, and the props seem to keep their promise :)
Tomorrow I will switch on the video camera and see if there is some jello. The GCS cinetank default btw did not work too well for me, for one there is a typo in it ;), but worse is an expo of -4 for yaw, which made mine very twitchy. Changed it to +5 and got a nice smooth rotation. That's what you want for a video quad. Guess I will go through all details of the tuning soon :)
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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mazevx

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2015, 02:50:50 am »
I had some serious yaw problems on my black snapper with graupner e prop, tried tuning everything but still jumps and wobbles with every yaw Input... Then changed to aeronaut cam carbon... Problem solved!  Why? I dont know... think the profile of the blade is simply good!
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2015, 12:41:45 pm »
I think that propellers need more attention than I put in them before. The frame I know best now is the Nighthawk 250. I flew it with 5040 Gemfans first. Those fly very nice, but they break at the first slight touch, which is really annoying, as even a slight ground touch during land will damage the prop so much that you have to replace it. Basically I had to change one or two props for every flight. So I changed to 6045 nylon Gemfans. They are far more endurable, but they produce a strong jello on the videos. 6045 Carbon are better, but still produced jello. My next try will be 6030 Carbon-Nylon mix. I have one more variable, as one of the motor axis has a bit dalliance, which I would guess may increase vibrations, too.

I tested the Cinetank with 9045 Nylon props. They fly ok, but not really nice, and they produce a lot vibrations, and a jello in the Mobius. So I looked for props which are recommended for DJI phantom (as my motors have Phanto style shanks) or TBS Discovery. All reviews found the Aero-Naut CAM light to be the best of all. I will test them today :)
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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cato

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2015, 10:41:40 pm »
OK, test flight was brillant. Unfortunately weather was very bad, so I could only take a few minutes of very unpleasant weather, and due to the dim light and so far no light set on the cinetank, I had difficulties to see it's orientation even at 15m distance. In this video I am testing more how it reacts and video quality is only second. https://www.dropbox.com/home/public?preview=cinetank%2Baeronout-testflight.mp4

unfortunately due to a last minute change the sensor callibration was off, and the flying is a bit strange. But it's very good to see that there is no jello at all. Motors and propellers produce lots of power, with the current setup it reacts prompt and precise. Only change to the cloud setup is expo, which does clearly not fit my setup. Instead of 10/10/-4 p/r/y I use 5/5/5. The standard setup feels as someone would expect from those values, twitchy on yaw while a bit sluggish on pitch and roll. I like the slight expo though, as it will make smooth turns more easy.
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Nighthawk 250, MT1806, 12A ESC OneShot125, Revo, M8n GPS, FPV
Cinetank MKII, Elite 2216, 30A Afro OneShot125, Revo Clone, M8N GPS
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hburke

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Re: Cinetank MKII
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2015, 08:48:34 pm »
great looking build cato! this has me interested in this frame now  ;D

i have never had tube type arms though. do you like those see any differences? they seem like they might be stronger and be more aerodynamic. im not sure i have any motors that i can spare though. time to ask the wife for more money! , LOL  ;D

harold
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