LibrePilot Forum
Development => GCS General => Topic started by: rcbsimoes on July 13, 2018, 09:02:11 am
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Hi all!
Can someone point me out a tutorial on using revo as combridge to set the BT device up?
There are alot using FTDI..
and I dont have one FDTI, nor do I want to install FTDI drivers.
ComBridge I want to use! ;)
Thanks
Cheers,
Rui
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If I understand it correctly one has to:
1) have the Revo communicating with GCS.
2) Change the hardware settings to VPC and ComBridge. (on the Hardware tab)
3) Save and Unplug Revo. (Force reboot)
4) Connect the BT and Power (batt + bec) to Revo and plug it back. (boot)
5) Open a Putty (or equivelent) session to the com port.
What I don't know is:
Am I supposed to leave the GCS running or not?
I couldn't find the Baud rate settings... It's not on the Hardware tab.
Do we set the baud rate to be the same as expected on the BT device?
Rui
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Why not use Oplink instead? ???
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Because I have an BT among my stuff already.
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It's working.
Some un install device (on windows) a couple of times...
And keep the USB and Main Port as Telemetry the whole time!
Next step, try and tune the stabilized flying modes.
Cheers,
Rui
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If you can hover without crashing and it has a "Revo class" FC, then you can use AutoTune flight mode.
https://librepilot.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/LPDOC/pages/25657377/AutoTune
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Hi,
I managed to stay in one piece but... it was really hard.
Rate mode was almost ok. With some minor sudden direction changes..
Attitude, was really terrible. Once, just after switching to Att came nose down.. lucky me i was high enough to change it back to manual (or rate..) and regain control over it. When trying to fly straight (att), it would drift (not keeping its heading) and shake a bit too much. Att could not keep the height too...
I think, even the manual mode was weird. maybe the CG was off too... I felt it was a bit nose heavy sometimes.
I was wondering if this is 1) normal, 2) poor settings 3) poor hardware placement on the plane.
Next week I will give it another try. Will try to make a onboard video to have your comments.
Cheers,
Rui
PS. Its much more relaxing to fly manual (no fc) for now.
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Just noticed, this is a bit off topic.
I probably should start another topic, like "setting up Revo" or so..
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Hi,
I guess you are referring to Revo on a fixed wing, not multirotor?! Don't know if Autotune is applicable here. Also, it is desireable the plane to be trimmed fine for manual flight (correct CG is really important!). Small imperfections in control surfaces trims will be handled by FC in stabilized modes.
There should be something wrong with your PIDs, did you changed default values? I have built two planes so far with Revo FC, Wing Z84 and MiniTalon and maidened them directly in Attitude with default PIDs, both successfully. Further tuned PIDs in-flight through TxPID module. But the defaults were fine and planes were easily controllable.
Attitude mode doesn't keep height automatically, neither for multirotors, nor for planes. It just levels the UAV. If you see drifts in Attitude, you may have the FC not perfectly aligned when mounted in the fuselage. Play with AttitudeSettings / BoardRotation to cure the undesired drift.
Violent vibrations can disturb gyros and accelerometers, do you have a lot of vibrations with motor running?
Here is short clip of MiniTalon - takeoff in Attitude mode with 20% evelator, some flight and landing in Rate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_X7aTIczvg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_X7aTIczvg)
And its maiden in Attitide with default PIDs. Bad roll to the right is caused by 100% throttle leading to massive torque roll ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HffzPPTzsNc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HffzPPTzsNc)
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"There should be something wrong with your PIDs, did you changed default values? "
I did. i was following a youtub video on how to set the PID up, and.. maybe that was it.
Guess i should also try the "Further tuned PIDs in-flight through TxPID module". Have to look into it.
"Attitude mode doesn't keep height automatically, neither for multirotors, nor for planes. It just levels the UAV"
I thought it did. Has a barometer...
if not to keep the height, what is the baro for?
As to level the UAV. I dont really know whats the level for my uav. I guess it gets leveled when it's flying keeping the same height...
I do have vibrations. If they are little or too much... that I dont know.
I had the REVO glued to the uav (scotch tape). so i supposed it gets all the vibrations, still I ve flown in diferent engine speeds and I didnt notice any changes.
next week I will try to make some nice shots and videos. maybe from there you can point out what i am doing wrong.
thanks cheers!
Rui
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Barometer is useful when RevoFC is set to use INS13, not Complementary. In autonomous modes like PositionHold, ReturnToBase, PathPlanner, etc. the FC can maintain height and/or course automatically using all sensors, incl. baro.
FC does see its own attitude and attempts to maintain it. If the UAV goes down in attitude mode and cruise throttle, you can fool the FC that it is tilted (pitched) slightly down (few degrees negative on AttitudeSettings / BoardRotation.Pitch). Thus, when trying to level itself, the FC will point the nose of the plane slightly up ;)
For example, I've set BoardRotation.Pitch = -2 for Z-84.
What is your plane? I can post here the current .uav files for my Z84 and MiniTalon to use settings there as start point or for comparison.
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thats a nice tip! thanks, i will use it next time i try!
I am trying to have a bixler2 going on a waypoint missing.
first, flying straight. :)
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So is this fixed wing?
Vibrations can cause this kind of problem. Bad vibration makes the sensors go crazy. Balance the prop(s). Is the motor shaft bent? That must be fixed.
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hey!
yes its a fixed wing. Bixler.
it's a push plane that never ever has crashed. i dont think the shaft is bent. the propeller... well ive never balanced it. i can see some vibration when i place a small cam on it.
here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFvzFR-HBnc
next week i will give it another try with the revo fc.
following your tips.
cheers,
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Hi,
This seems to me as a LOT of vibrations... Cannot judge, however, if they are enough to fool the sensors, maybe not. I've never flown a model vibrating so much. I like flying FPV and vibrations spoil the feeling (CMOS FPV Cams) and HD video so I always try to avoid them ;)
I'd carefully balance the motor first using some vibration meter app (w/o prop installed), then the prop itself. Then, to be as perfect as possible, I'd find the best position of the mounted prop against motor bell (with minimal vibrations). And even more, I'd try if sticking tiny pieces of blenderm or other suitable tape on the prop, usually close to the shaft, would further decrease the remaining vibrations.
Of course, this makes sense if one flies long time with one and same prop. If there is a significant chance to brake it after some flights (like with racing quads), I personally don't bother balancing props, unless they are exceptionally badly balanced out-of-box :)
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Hi,
I have the Revo fixed and configure (default parameters) on my bixler.
Can someone post pictures how to attach the revo board to the plane? mine is attached with Velcro band. Wonder if it's enough to isolate the vibrations.
Thanks in advance,
Rui
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I don't think some special isolation is necessary. I have no isolation on any of UAVs with CC3D/Revo. I attach the FC to the frame / fuselage with double-sided adhesive PU tape.
In fact, once tested a ZMR250 with additional vibro-isolation under the FC and the result was worse responce and handling.
Here is Revo placement in the Wing Z84 - stacked over the PDB board, that is glued to the EPO (picture attached)...
And a link to RCGroups with my MiniTalon brief description with photos, you can see the Revo placement on the gear deck, glued in the fuselage:
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=39982936&postcount=13905 (https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=39982936&postcount=13905)
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All of mine that are in fixed wing (Bixler2 and similar but smaller) are mounted to nylon standoffs and the standoffs are glued in. If your prop is OK (preferably balanced) you shouldn't have vibration problems with a fixed wing.
I actually had one mounted on Velcro one time. Although I don't do that any more, I worry (not a very big problem) that the Velcro could:
- allow a "few degrees" of slop, like whether some connecting wires were pulling on the FC
- be mounted a "few degrees" different if you took the FC out and put it back
This would make it fly a "few degrees" from level.
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Hi all,
I've tried again. No, doesn't work for me. I find it easier to manually fly it than with the Mini Revo... i just cant rely on it.
Pretty sure it's the vibration thing. I will try to balance the prop. Never done it before..
Mean while, can i ask you to share pictures on how you fixed the REVO?
Mine is attached outside the plane nose with velcro. Is this ok? does it have to be sheltered from the wind/light? how important is it to have the arrow (printed on revo) aligned with the plane longitudinal axis?
I would say as long as you do the calibration with it fixed and dont change the position you're good. but.. not sure anymore.
Am I expecting too much??
My plan is to build a plane that can fly with waypoints. for that i need a reliable flight controller. Am I using the wrong one? Just found out that Matek has a FC made for fixed wings (F405 WING). Is it that different??
for now, I will try to decouple the revo from the plane with some springs and balance the prop. then i will give it one more try.
Thanks for your comments
Rui
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The baro will not work correctly if outside in the airstream. That will be a problem for any GPS flight mode, but won't affect other modes like Rate and Attitude.
Revo / Mini Revo should be fine for fixed wing waypoint flight.
The biggest problem seems to be that there aren't as many people flying fixed wing and there are some settings to set and others to tune.
If you can fly Manual, then start with that and after getting it trimmed that way, adjust the linkages manually and put the transmitter trims back in the center (important).
I suggest that you always leave the rudder in Manual mode for all advanced settings.
Get it flying in Rate mode by taking off in Manual and switching to Rate. Fly at high speed and adjust PIDs for best response without oscillation.
Do the same with Attitude mode, but take off in Rate and switch to Attitude since the PIDs wind up in Manual and a direct switch from Manual to Attitude will usually cause completely crazy flight (like full elevator and full aileron) for a few seconds. A work around is to go to zero throttle just before switching to Attitude, since that zeros the windup.
It uses Attitude mode during GPS flight. There are still things to tweak in FixedWingPathFollowerSettings and AltitudeSettings. Probably start by importing the *.uav file that I posted for you in the other thread. It has the stuff you need, but not things that will overwrite things like transmitter setup and board calibrations.
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Hi,
thanks. My comments in your text below:
The baro will not work correctly if outside in the airstream. That will be a problem for any GPS flight mode, but won't affect other modes like Rate and Attitude.
I do not have a GPS. yet..
so only Rate and Att for now.
Revo / Mini Revo should be fine for fixed wing waypoint flight.
Good to know.
The biggest problem seems to be that there aren't as many people flying fixed wing and there are some settings to set and others to tune.
If you can fly Manual, then start with that and after getting it trimmed that way, adjust the linkages manually and put the transmitter trims back in the center (important).
I can fly manual (without the Revo). If I use the revo in manual mode it already feels shaky..
I suggest that you always leave the rudder in Manual mode for all advanced settings.
That's how i use it. Both Rate and Att with manual Rudder.
Get it flying in Rate mode by taking off in Manual and switching to Rate. Fly at high speed and adjust PIDs for best response without oscillation.
Have to try this one. Normally I switch from manual to Rate or manual to ATT. Maybe that's the mistake.
Do you adjust the PIDs during flight? I know this is a possibility which i didnt try. Do you have anything writen on this? Like: if the plane does this, you should do that..
Also I normally dont fly in high speed, maybe that's one other thing..
Do the same with Attitude mode, but take off in Rate and switch to Attitude since the PIDs wind up in Manual and a direct switch from Manual to Attitude will usually cause completely crazy flight (like full elevator and full aileron) for a few seconds. A work around is to go to zero throttle just before switching to Attitude, since that zeros the windup.
I will use the other procedure, go from manual to rate, and after a while from Rate to Att.
It uses Attitude mode during GPS flight. There are still things to tweak in FixedWingPathFollowerSettings and AltitudeSettings. Probably start by importing the *.uav file that I posted for you in the other thread. It has the stuff you need, but not things that will overwrite things like transmitter setup and board calibrations.
Ok. I will try that too.
Thanks again,
Rui
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If I use the revo in manual mode it already feels shaky..
Manual mode should be like the FC wasn't there at all. In Manual mode the FC copies from input to output without modification. If you do a special setup procedure, it should be exactly the same as when Rx is plugged straight into servos. In any case, it should not ever be "shaky" when flying Manual mode.
Special procedure:
If you have an airplane already flying without an FC and want to add an FC (initially in Manual mode) you run the wizard and then hand copy all the Input slider settings to the Output tab sliders, after that, each input value produces the same output value and it is exactly the same whether the FC is there or not (except for a slight delay added by the FC). This procedure assumes you are using a PWM receiver but will probably also work if you change out the multiple PWM servo connections for a single PPM FC connection (that all use normal 1000us-2000us control pulse widths). It is a very good idea to manually adjust the linkages so that the transmitter trims can be put in the center before running the wizard.
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Hi all,
Finally back on track here.
I have the plane flying again. Manual, Rate and att work okish.
Now, I have the OP GPS.
I've connected and did the procedures to have it working.
The problem now is, as soon as I switch to GPS Navigations INS13, I can no longer arm the craft.
And that the only thing. If I go back to Basic Complementary it's all good.
Aparently either the compass (i've changed the allowed error to .30) or the GPS (even when set to 2sats only) don't feed good/reliable info for the FC to arm.
Which GPS and/or compass are you using?
I found another one on Bangg and HK. UbloxNeo. It's a bit more expensive. Aparently better too.
But I dont want to buy another one that doesnt work.
PLease advise on which GPS to use. (assuming this is the problem)
Thanks!!!
Cheers,
Rui
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If you have set HomeLocation and done all calibrations (e.g. mag) and all your sensor healths are green then it should arm, but be aware that it will not arm in GPS modes. You should arm and take off in Attitude or Rate mode, then switch to a GPS mode when in the air.
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"If you have set HomeLocation and done all calibrations (e.g. mag) and all your sensor healths are green then it should arm, but be aware that it will not arm in GPS modes."
I did all the calibrations and set home location. I keep the mode one selected (RATE).
Sensor health Att and Stab turn red as soon as i switch GPS Navigation IN13 (or any other besides Basic Complementary).
I can see that the magnetometer has (sometimes) 20%..30% error.
The GPS sensor, does turn amber. Occasionally Green.
Can the magnetometer be the cause of the red sensors (att and stab) and preventing the arming?
Just changing the configuration to Basic Complementary, sensors turn green and i can arm the device. (Also removing the Postion Hold switch)
I forgot to mention, I was doing this inside my apartment. Can the magnetometer show this level of error because of this?
Are you using the small OP GPS? Where is the compass, in the GPS or on the Revo Board?
Cheers,
Rui
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If the mag is seeing 20-30% wow to answer your questions
Can the magnetometer be the cause of the red sensors (att and stab) and preventing the arming?
Yes, it will not arm until it's below mag alarm error
Same for satellites will not arm until it see enough.
Just changing the configuration to Basic Complementary, sensors turn green and i can arm the device. (Also removing the Postion Hold switch)
This because the FC does not use gps or mags in this mode that's why you get green
I forgot to mention, I was doing this inside my apartment. Can the magnetometer show this level of error because of this?
Don't calibrate the mag in apartment there is to much Magnetic Fields produced by the household wiring best to do it away from the building. Away from any mains power. Also when you do the mag calibration do it with all of the items on e.g vtx, hd camera, leds,
Are you using the small OP GPS? Where is the compass, in the GPS or on the Revo Board?
I use op8 with Revo on board mags with much success.
do you have a picture of the wiring and where the FC is placed?
Are there any high voltage wires near?
What is powering the fc?
Any magnets on the airframe e.g lid holding-wing joinings?
I have my wing 1meter with a revo, op8 gps, osd, airspeed sensor, hd camera, fpv system,
Fly's great.
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Thanks!
I will try to calibrate outside. it has been raining out here...
and get some pictures.
Rui
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Be aware that mag calibration is supposed to work better via OpLink than via USB.
Further discussion for those who are interested:
I don't know if poor mag calibration when using USB is because the metal USB plug is magnetized or whether it is because FC current takes a different path when powered via USB.
If it is because of a different current path, then powering with battery via permanent 5.5V to 6V BEC while using USB to do mag calibration ... would make it use the battery current path and make it calibrate better.
Simple test to try with your USB cable is to use USB cable #2 to plug into computer. View mag data any of several ways while you move the end of the USB cable #1 around very close to the FC. If you see the mag data change then you know your USB cable #1 connector is magnetized.